"No more saviours."

Interview with fleecy moss

How is your company going? Did you advance since we talked last time?

We have one VC group really tearing up our business plan at the moment. They are very excited, but no one gives you millions until they are absolutely sure. What is good is that the more ppl who read our business plan, and a lot of these are senior ppl with decades of experience, they tell us that it gives them chills as they slowly understand what computing and the future can, and should be like.

I would love to give a date, but if there's one thing I've learnt, it's that anything can get in the way, and I don't want ppl waiting for dates, the same way I waited with others for all the other missed dates.

You have found an OS partner. Can you disclose the name already? What are the rules of the game - who will control the development of the kernel in the future?

Yes we have found a partner - I have been watching them for some time, and I am very excited because I found them whilst looking for future plans for KOSH. Their product provides a lot of what we were going to design into the KOSH lower layers. Once we started talking to them, we liked them even more.

As for control, they have a product that sits low to middle. We have a product that sits middle to high. We will work together because we are not in each others markets strictly, and where we are, we will both profit.

If you can't disclose the identity of your partner, could you at least say if it's a known vendor and what market are they focusig on? Do they hold some credit in the industry or is it an early start-up?

They are very highly regarded, not just for their product but for their approach, support and customer relations. We have spoken at length to their partners and customers, and all of them rave about their product. They are looking forwards to giving one hell of a set of demos to the community.

Do Amino and your partner agree on this scheme?
Kernel supplier < > Amino < > OEMs

Although separate, we will leverage each other, and where common action and presentation is required, we will work together.

QNX refused to participate in such a scheme... What was the problem?

That is something that is in the past. We don't rule out working with them in the future, and they have an excellent product.

What is the business plan of Amino then? What exactly will you provide? Interface? Experience? Whole SW architecture? Reference HW designs?

Amino's vision statement is to provide a total digital convergence solution. However, this isn't convergence as defined by many - talking toasters and internet ordering fridges. It refers to the convergence of all forms of information into a digital format that exists within a single context, a context in which the user is king, and can interact, process, manipulate and build. There is a great deal of computer snobbery, and a great fear that all our computer skills and knowledge will become somehow less worthy, but the truth is that this brave new digital world will be a world of virtual magic in which users can learn as little or as much of that magic as possible.

Our business plan is twofold - the nuturing and evangelism of a community of artists, developers, tech heads, geeks, and digital adventurers, and as an empowering set of technologies for OEMS and IHVs who will produce the future digital systems, using our Domestic Digital Habitat model. The "pathfinder" community will forge out ahead using the latest technologies and then these will be matured into the DDH product line (DDH, Domestic Digital Habitat: a home/family that consumes and generates digital content).

AQUA will provide a modular solution, that can either be used in total or be used in parts. We will push HW standards and references, in conjunction with our partners, but we intend for our product to run everywhere.

Any schedule how will you advance?

The pathfinder market will be our first milestone, getting a developer system and community working, using Bill's contacts and skills to bring ppl across, and then moving towards a first consumer release. In the background, the DDH process will follow.

Could you specify the kernel shortly if possible? Does it rock? ;-) Is it POSIX compliant? How is it portable? Which CPUs does it run at the moment on?

All very good questions that will help you to narrow it down, start endless speculation and eventually piss ppl off. Just be patient.

Is it a self-hosted enviroment like QNX? What about developer tools? Do they have Code Warior?

It has the standard code development tools, as well as one very nice IDE.

You announced that you want the community to be actively involved in your company (inclusive business model). QNX is 100% private owned company and they won't sell shares to anyone. So no chance for the direct inclusion of the community in the body of the company. Was this the crucial point in your negotiations with QNX?

We want the community to own as much of Amino as is possible. That was the purpose behind me offering the community the chance to invest at the VC level, but that had a very poor response. Now we have to go the VC way, and they will own a percentage, and look for an IPO to see their money increased. We intend to make sure that the Amiga community is given all the help it can to own shares at that time.

Besides that, we will always work with the community. It is OUR GREATEST ASSET, but unlike Gateway, we understand that we are a servant of the community, and will expend as much effort as possible to become the third tier of the community in the trinity of user, developer and platform provider. We hope to provide ample proof of our commitment as soon as we are moving.

What community will you work in two or three years with? A number of Amigans, if not each and every one, uses some other OS almost regularly. So the community will split sooner or later: some will go PHX, some will go AmigaOS 3.5+ and some will just quit (if not already) and switch to the other OS they use.

The Amiga community may go in different directions. We hope to convince them that ours is the best direction. Others will do likewise. We are very keen on seeing the Amigans who left to go to Mac and PC and Linux return to the fold. We believe we have the product, path and future that will bring them. We also know of the huge dissatisfaction with MS amongst users, developers, OEMs, IHVs and ISVs. They are willing us on to provide a new solution.

No matter where we go though, we will try to maintain the value and spirit of the community, but that is a two way process. We hope that when we can announce, ppl will look, tear apart, ask questions, ridicule, praise, and laugh at us, and with us. Such is the way communities work.

Are you basically saying that you believe developers and users will come back in 2-3 years and switch to AQUA as their prefered system?

We believe it will take a year. Our solution, partners, and future is that compelling.

Time is critical. With the exception of the money and one piece, we have been ready for over a month.

Is the partner well-disposed to your notion of actively cooperating community?

They are very disposed to community, and the feedback from their clients suggests that they really understand that their success is in their clients success.

If they are apt to your vision, will you built upon what was proposed for KOSH? I mean from the organizational/structural point of view (different colour shares, credits, dealing with the profit, etc.)

From the technical point of view, we will be moving in a KOSH direction. Organisationally, because we have had to go through a standard VC system, this will be be more difficult. We will consult with the community to see how we can best take our place in the trinity.

Does the concept of the choosen kernel conform to the idea of The Object Sea? In general, will you built upon the ideas proposed for KOSH?

When you get to read through the tech docs for the kernal, you will see why I got so excited about it, and why we want to use it. As I said above, KOSH is the way I want to proceed. For me, it started with OASYS, and then went to KOSH, now it will move to Amino. We want to get the community involved and our website, community policy, and interaction with the community will reflect the value we put on the community.

Actually, how is the KOSH going? Are you actively participating? Or should we understand it the way KOSH is a "hatch" of ideas/concepts for Amino and it's product?

The ideas behind KOSH have been germinating in the minds of many Amigans and non Amigans for a long time. I took mine and stuffed them in OASYS - Once I realised where Schindler was going, or wasn't going, I tried to start KOSH. However, as I talked more with Bill, and as KOSH developed, it became apparent, to me anyway, that there was a potential to see KOSH, or the ideas behind KOSH, realised. I have not been as active in the KOSH organisation, but have been working towards seeing it realised. My desk, laptop and paper pads are littered with diagrams and notes on the pieces required. A great hunk of that can be supplied by our partner, another chunk can be supplied by Rebol. KOSH was never a hatch, but a spot along the river of good ideas. As we move, so we take the ideas with us.

What about this analogy:
QNX < > Phoenix < > TAC
and
Amino + your partner < > KOSH < > TAC

Amino intends to produce a set of products that is KOSH like. TAC is an obvious portal for the community. We want to work with the community.

I don't think there IS an Amiga Inc path - what they are providing seems to be an object toolkit - you can probably buy it or download it like any other app.

The second is the classic path, represented by Haage & Partner and their AmigaOS 3.5. Some sources say, they consider further upgrades/versions, maybe loosely following what Apple did with the 68k MacOS when they switched to PowerPC. Is there a real perspective?

Well, OS3.5 isn't theirs - it's Amiga Inc's, so it will depend on them. Yes, there is a possible path there. We hope to work with H&P in the future and have great respect for their work.

Actually, how do you feel about the AmigaOS Open Source Initiative? We saw insightful comments from Olaf Barthel and Holger Kruse pointing out the real difficulties of this effort. Both are against open sourcing AmigaOS.

I have always supported this, ever since it became obvious that using alternatives to advance the Amiga was probably a better solution. The Amiga community is really the single factor that made the classic OS so valuable and successful, and it is only right that it should be given back to that community. I have spoken to Steve at length, and we are in agreement on a wide range of issues relating to open sourcing the classic.

The key to this, as to Amino itself is product, evangelism and resource available for expansion. Having the greatest product in the world is useless if all this does is move 50k Amigans to another platform that stays at 50k. To expand that to 1M or 10M takes much more than just good technology. As has been proved in the past many times, technology is not usually the driving force in market success.

And the fourth path, is the path of yours. Your solution will compete with Neutrino. Folks like Dave Haynie, formerly participating in KOSH actively, are now supporting Phoenix, which focuses on Neutrino. Can you comment this?

I have chatted with Dave. He supports QSSL/PHX because there is more information and it seems like product is near. We haven't said very much because we don't want to until we have everything in place. Once real product, plans, and investment starts, then is the time for ppl to make their choices. I am very supportive of the PHX concept. I am just not supportive of their decision to bind themselves to a single kernal.

Your standpoint is that folks should wait and then decide which way to go. But you have nothing now, or can't tell yet. The same applies to Phoenix, but they should be much nearer to real product than anyone else. As the competitive party, what is your opinion?

QSSL/PHX say they are nearer to real product. We know from day 1 how long it will take us to get developer machines, and then consumer machines out the door. Day 1 though depends on financing being secured, and not just enough for six months, but enough to commit to our plan for a good three years, otherwise we might blow up in six months time and blow the rest of the community up with us. We aren't going to make any promises until we know we can make an honest and total commitment to the community.

We still hope to work with PHX.

Amino is now in the process of negotiations with VC. It will took cca one month. Then you can finally set-up the team and begin the real development. Do you think it's reasonable to expect remaining developers will wait, let's say, one year using outdated Amigas and watching the market shrinking? The same applies to users...

Our partner already has a development system. We have already notified many of our team and have commitments from them. We are raring to go. We understand that the developers need something concrete, and need to eat. We understand that users need product. Once we start moving, we will be very public with our progress and in the promotion and progress of all those who join us. It won't be a case of see you in 12 months time - it will be hands on, interactive, taking part - in effect, what a real community should be. This 4 year sitting dead on the ocean is what has damaged our community. Once the wind fills the sails, we hope the excitement will suffice until we finally reach land.

From your point of view, are you really giving alternative to remaining Amigans? Or what market are you fighting for/targeting?

From our PoV - yes. Many of my best friends are Amiga developers, and I have watched more than a few see their dreams brought down by the inaction and negligence of the past few years. I like to sleep at night, and I wouldn't be able to if I thought I was talking the community for a ride. Unfortunately, to do it right requires time, resources and a solid plan. As in good development, if you put the time in at the design stage, it more than rewards you in the testing and debugging stage. That is what we are trying to do now.

I fear, except your friends (who need to eat, too) and core AQUA developers/users, you would begin on a green pasture, community-wise. "To expand that [50k Amigans] to 1M or 10M takes much more than just good technology." To expand from nearly 0 to 1M or 10M is surely much more demanding. So you have a good reason to "still hope to work with PHX."

I think that with our roots in the Amiga community and past, our close and deep contacts within the developer community, our unique approach and our rich channels into the outside world, that will not be a problem. That was our issue with previous solutions. Whilst the technology is important, staying power, commitment and resources is much more important.

We would be very happy to work with PHX, but we will not base our products and plans on QNX.

Anyway, I wish you and Bill only the best. Thank you for your time, fleecy.

I know you do Andrej, and I thank you for your time and interest. We are really close, and I am just dying to share all of this with you, and the rest of the community.

Lastly, could you tell us a few words about yourself? What are your life "drugs"?

Football, wine, the outdoors, women, things that set my heart racing.

Please name your top 5 movies...

Silent Running
Blade Runner (director's cut)
Most anything French (Red, White, Blue; Delicattese; City of lost children)
Anything by the Coen brothers (Fargo/The Big Lebowski)
The Piano

Series...

Red Dwarf
Black Adder
Between the Lines (UK police show)
Babylon 5
The Clangers

Music...

Bush
Counting Crows
Radiohead
Opera
Oasys

Beer...

(only five???)

Wadworths 6X
Burton Ale
Old Peculiar
Dorchester IPA
Hardingtons

And computer games...

Cannon Fodder 1
Dune
Quake 2
Diablo
Baldurs Gate

Your favourite books and authors?

Anna Karenin (Tolstoy) is the greatest book I have ever read.
DH Lawrence
Turgenev
Dickens - Hard Times is wonderful
Neuromancer was excellent - the rest crap
Terry Pratchett and Douglas Adams
Anything by Sheri Tepper

What are your other hobbies and sports?

Football, football, and football
Ski-ing, orienteering
Computer games
Gardening
Getting bladdered with me mates

Try some 'boarding, if I can recommend: Snowboarding or Windsurfing or Surfing. I have my experiences (except the last one).

Will be trying snowboarding this year.

Your denomination? What do you believe in?

I am a taoist, or at least try to be.

Try to characterize yourself and what you endavour after in your life in, in cca 30 words.

I just want to wake up happy to be alive, and not want to go to sleep because I might miss something.

What do you think is your dominant personal quality?

I am driven.

Finally, would you like to tell us something special? Something no journalist has never ever asked you before and you would like to tell.

I like to wear dresses.

Really? Poor Evie. ;-)

She wears my soccer boots so it's an even trade.