"No more saviours."

Interview with fleecy moss

Well, as you correctly point out above, the idea was to enable ppl to create, to code, to draw, to model, to compose. All of these are verbs - doing words. What they emphasize is that the Amiga wanted ppl to be able to get on and do work without getting in the way. In this sense, the computer was supposed to be invisible.

That was true in the 1980s and is even more true as we move towards the future. Our society is digitising content at a rapid pace, and providing the tools to manipulate and interact with this content.

Traditionally, the technology starts off in a pre-eminent position, with the task being subservient and then, as the technology matures, it should slowly dip below the surface and the task becomes everything. This is how the Digital Information revolution should be, but this is being stopped because traditional computer models are holding on for dear life, failing to evolve and are preventing normal ppl from becoming comfortable with relating to digital content.

This logjam will eventually clear, but the next decade or so could see some messy botches and half hearted attempts. Anyone applying the Amiga philosophy to this problem should see some very impressive results. In the end, I think the term home computer will disappear. There will just be digital services, whether that is Internet, gaming, drawing, coding, composing or whatever.

As I said above - Content will be king. Some ppl poke fun at digital integrated future as meaning you can program your light switch or oven, but if you accept that content is king, then you have to look at sources and drains of that content. Videos, Stereos, clocks, phones, TV, cameras etc - all generate and consume content. What other content is there in the house? Books, bills, newspapers, homework. This is the stuff that can be digitised, and then made available to a digital network.

In the current model, ppl draw distinctions between these different types of content and activity - the rendering snob looks down on someone doing email, and insists that the systems requirements are different - but it is only HW and SW limitations that make that true - both are still content, and as those limitiations are reduced and eventually eliminated, then everything becomes the same.

For the Amiga, this is the correct direction because it is the only direction. The fact that ppl don't see that, and scoff at programmable kettles doesn't make it any less true. Fear and the desire to be different plays a big part here but it is going to happen regardless of those fears and desires. Technology marches on and we can either follow or lead.

Do you think they have the moral right to redefine what Amiga means ("Amiga was never about a box. It was never about an OS either. It was always about the better way." - Tom Schmidt) and turn it into just a kind of network interface for digital appliances?

Depends on your definition of Amiga - I am sure you won't disagree with the quote "it was always about the better way". The acid test is what do you define as an Amiga, and if you sit down in front of something and it gives you all and more that your classic Amiga gives you, then is it an Amiga?

At present we certainly define an Amiga as a computer - HW and SW, something that we can buy, take home and use. Now imagine a future ten years on where there are LCD screens everywhere. You can go to an airport and access the digital content universe. First thing it does is ask you what style you want - you chose AmigaOS 3.1 - and that is what you get. Are you now working on an Amiga?

The hire of an ex-Apple employee Rick LeFaivre and his explanation of not using QNX ("As we talked to a wide variety of partners and potential partners in the industry, we got a very lukewarm reception to QNX ... At he same time, we heard over and over that companies were lining up behind Linux as the only alternative to Windows.") hints something about their "revolutionary" way of thinking and background of their development. What's your conclusion?

Linux is a bandwagon and more and more ppl see it as the only way to really challenge Microsoft. This creates a snowball effect. Given the IPO successes of anyone involved or hinting at involvement in Linux, then it makes sense if a company wants to make a lot of money, and allows them to take advantage of all the Linux development and partners out there. From a technology point of view, QNX is clearly superior. It thus becomes a strategic decision. Do you want to be successful, or be the best? The two, whilst not mutually exclusive, certainly have a hard time cohabiting.

The fact is they wanted to hire only seasoned veterans with 8+ years proven of industry experience in contrary to the young radicals from the crazy Los Gatos team (eg. Carl was 25 then, "Dale Luck looked like average off-the-street homeless hippy..." to quote Jay Miner). What are your expectations about the "revolutionary" Amiga, Inc. product?

Revolutions are where ppl see their lives change radically. My big fear as I watched AInc hire ppl was that these ppl have spent ten years in the same industry that they now claim they want to revolutionise - spend too long in something and you become it. Revolution tends to come from outside the mainstream, where reasons other than business success drive development. I would pit ten good Amiga developers against those "veterans" anyday in a competition to produce a revolution.

It seemed Jim Collas had a concrete plan what should have been done with Linux to make it multimedia ready and a better place for AmigaObjects to live in. Do you miss Jim Collas or have you spoken with him recently? Will we heard of him yet?

I spoke frequently with Jim and was very fond of him. I disagreed with him on quite a few points, and I think he got a bit too caught up in the "Amiga saviour" bit, but on the whole he was a breath of fresh air and wasn't scared to push when it was needed. Of course, big business, whilst always claiming that it wants go getters and innovators, is always terrifed of them.

We have chatted since his departure, but I imagine Gateway has tied him up good and tight in a severance clause, and he will probably go the way of Joe Torre - disappearing for a year or so and enjoying himself in the process. There again, he might just surprise us all. The thing to remember is that it, whilst Jim was a good guy, the Amiga is more than just one guy, and even now, there are other good guys stepping up.

The basic element of their notion of "a better way" are probably still the AmigaObjects. Don't you think it's reinventing the wheel (given it seem as a mix of Java and Jini) and, of course, if they will sit on the TOP of an OS, they can hardly ensure the true Amiga feel of low-latency multimedia behaviour.

But you are defining Amiga in a different manner to them, so of course they will be different. The glory of such a generic vision as "a better way" is that it can mean anything you want it to - welcome to corporate marketing and PR ;-)

I have said from the start that AmigaObjects won't be a revolution. Several companies are working on similar concepts, HAVi, Jini, Rebol, NextObjects, Inferno, Elate, to name just a few. No one has a full architecture working properly at the moment but that is not through want of trying.

As for networking and communicating computers and appliances (simply different contexts) over the network, there is IMHO a much better solution already available and is by many considered truly innovative, if not revolutionary. I'm speaking about REBOL...

Couldn't agree more.

Just a few days after the early September earthquakes in Amiga, Inc. a group of Amigans, you including, came with a plan, how to finally put the destiny of Amiga in the hands of the community. Could you please describe how and when did this plan come to life, who was the initiator, who participates in this and what are the relationships between the participating subjects?

Many Amigans see this blurly, as "just another effort" or as an immediate reaction to Amiga, Inc. happenings, maybe stimulated by the sacking of your friend and the last Amiga enthusiast there, Bill McEwen.

Okay - things are mixed up here. The group of which you speak is called Phoenix, and is a developers and notables organisation. Amino is a member of it, but we are not a driving force within it. Others are organising and pushing it forwards.

A part of the plan is your and Bill's new company called Amino. How is Amino organized, is it already an officially registred company? Long-time Amiga evangelist, Giorgio Gomelsky, who participated in all the initiatives promoting the idea of independence from mother companies (the first one was IAS, in 1994) supports and puts forth non-traditional models of managing a company. Is Amino going this inclusive model of business which supports active participation of the community?

Amino is a company formed by Bill and I to take all the plans that we formulated whilst at Amiga Inc, but which were never used by them, and provide for a complete digital convergence solution. Part of that is the development of a leading edge platform that we hope will inherit and carry forwards the ideals of the classic Amiga computer and community.

We recognise that a community is a huge asset to any platform, and that the company/customer model is unable to take advantage of that asset. However, developing a platform and a product line is a costly proposition, and raising the sort of capital required to do it successfully is better suited to a traditional model. For Amino, we want the best of both worlds. To do this, we intend to offer as much of the company as possible to the community. By having a stake in the company, and hopefully a controlling stake, then we will see the synergy of a community based structure maximised whilst protecting the platform from the usual business dangers of takeover, bankruptcy and market before morals.

Amino needs capital, as each and every startup. Are you going the path of venture capital to raise the funds and do you have some investors already? Isn't it rather risky plan?

Yes we do, and no it isn't. Risk is inherent in everything.

Recently, IBM started to provide complete CHRP designs freely and Motorola presented the PowerPC roadmap covering G4, G5, G6 and G7 processors... How does the business plan of Amino relate to the longer-term plan of Phoenix to set up a new platform, and what is the position of Amino in this?

A HW reference group has been formed within Phoenix and we are participating in it. Part of our distributed strategy is that we will concentrate only on the SW, and let the HW partners concentrate on the HW so that we can all work towards our own goals whilst benefiting from a common approach.

Amino would like to continue in the bequest and traditions of Amiga through additional "amigification" of QNX Neutrino, which is the most important element of the project. Amino wants to provide Amiga look and feel - the product should be called AmIE (Amiga Interactive Experience). Should it be a superset, a superstructure of Neutrino, retaining the full compatibility with original Neutrino?

QNX is one of the partners we are talking to, but there are other partners and options out there. As I said above, a successful future needs to be embedded in core competencies otherwise one company could attempt to become another dominator, a la MS or Commodore, and thus provide a single point of failure. For instance, if QNX went and tried to do the whole SW thing on their own, then the community is back in exactly the same position. We know what we are good at - user experiences and community development, and that is where we will concentrate, with the right partners.

You said, it would be inspired by I2++, KOSH and HAVi concepts. So, what are the fundamental paradigms and basic building blocks of AmIE?

Configurability, freedom, creativity, invisibility, universality. Separate abstracted layers allowing for peeling and rebuilding. Experential, dynamic, interaction based. As technophobic or technophilic are required by the user.

What about the missing concepts of Neutrino architecture, namely the concept of screens (probably not many Amigans would like the unixish grid of desktops) or datatypes? And does it support the localisation through some kind of catalogs, another useful feature of AmigaOS design?

We are not thinking in terms of Neutrino, or any other product. We are thinking in terms of the total experience and then working downwards. We do not want to tie ourselves to any models that might lead us down certain roads or saddle us with dificiences and compromises. We will find the partners to provide the pieces that we require to produce our product.

How much Carl Sassenrath is involved? REBOL should be one of the fundamental elements of AQUA. Does it mean, Carl will design the whole architecture, consisting of Neutrino, REBOL and Amino's AmIE enviroment?

Carl is busy working on Rebol and will help to develop and integrate it, as we also add our pieces to it.

How do you see the future of AQUA in the emerging mosaic of Digital Convergence?

As water flows everywhere and fills everything to the required level, so will AQUA. We see our Domestic Digital Habitat as providing a total solution model, and look forwards to realising it, and allowing ppl to experience it, and to partake of the parts or the whole that they see as empowering their lives.

Do you have any short-term solution? Something is needed to stop the diminishing of the Amiga community...

Once we have everything tied up, we will go straight to the developers and ask them what they require from us. AInc has left them all with a very nasty taste in their mouth and we have to prove to them that we will support them complete, and that their success is our priority. At the same time we will establish close and correct relationships with the press and the user groups to ensure that we have a healthy and productive two way flow of communications, ideas and criticisms.

A big part of the Amiga community is very upset now - all those years of empty claims, hopes, disbeliefs and vapor. Aren't you afraid, that if you are announcing Amino and AQUA NOW, despite there's no set-in-stone plan, conception and funding, that you are in fact supporting the disbelief in your effort?

Yes, we are concerned. We had no intention of revealing our presence until we could show something, and as I keep saying, ppl should remain highly skeptical of both us and anyone else offering a future, until they can see, touch and buy the claimed product. We announced ourselves because we were very concerned about the huge depression that tore through the community after the Collas and Schmidt announcements. It was not an easy choice to make. We may still fail - nothing is written in stone and nothing guarantees our success. We are just doing the best we can.

Many Amigans regard your previous efforts (eg. ICOA, KOSH) as a failure. They feel betrayed by Amiga, Inc. and are full of empty promises. Of course, the situation is quite different now - QNX and REBOL Technologies jumped in. Still, you need them all, if the plan should succeed. What will you do, what would you tell them here to convince them?

They have to be convinced themselves, and understand that this is a community, and a way of life for ppl, not just a market. We can only convince them with product, and that is what we are trying to do.

But that is life. I would be surprised if Bill did say that, since that doesn't sound like Bill, but the point is, the more you are burned, the further you sit from the fire. I have been very impressed with Fido and what he has done, and would certainly want him on any developer program for Amino. Rebuilding the community in partnership with the community will be one of our keys goals, but there is no point in even starting until we can guarantee that we have the money to be able to move forwards and commit to this. One of the reasons I fell out of Amiga Inc was because I kept explaining to Schindler and Havemose that this wasn't just a person's business, it was often their life, and that it was immoral to treat ppl in such a way. But big business doesn't care. You have to have been part of the community to understand this, and that is why I only put faith in those from the community providing a successful future. But there are lot of traps and holes along the way. We have the heart...but sometimes that is just not enough.

Again, we will have to wait and see.

Thanks.

Five weeks later...